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The Relics of Mu

Article #235 • Written by Jason Bellows

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It seems that most every culture has a legend of a great society, ripe with wealth and wisdom, which is lost to the sea. To westerners these are the stories of Atlantis or Thule. To many of the peoples of the South Pacific it is Lemuria or Menehune. To Asians it is called Mu, and was home to people who could fly and who drank an elixir that would cease aging.

After years of searching, and combing the Pacific for a possible lost land that could have been the root of one of these legends, it is clear that there is no extra continent in the sea. However, in 1986, a SCUBA diver, Kihachiro Aratake, diving off the coast of the island of Yonaguni-jima discovered something that may lend credence to the existence of Mu or Lemuria. On the sea floor he found vast geometric structures cut out of the rock. There was evidence of stairs, and improbable angles in the stone. He marked the location for future divers, and in the intervening years these undersea ruins have come to be known as the "Yonaguni Monuments".

Efforts to date the monument are derived from the last time the area was above sea level, which would have been approximately 8,000-10,000 years ago-- about 3-5 millennia before Egypt's pyramids were erected. If the monuments were indeed built by humankind, it would require some dramatic revisions to the accepted chronological history of humanity.

Not far from a set of cliffs called "Iseki Point", the main structure of the Yonaguni Monuments lies under about two hundred feet of water. It is about 240 feet long, 90 feet wide, and 45 feet tall. There appear to be clear cut stairs, and to many there are distinct similarities to ancient buildings found on Okinawa, or even heiau temples on Hawaii. Various structures surround the main building, and they seem to stretch out into a road spanning approximately 311 miles leading to Okinawa and its neighboring islands.

But as clearly defined as the structures are to some, there are others who disparage the tale of the Yonaguni Monuments. No chambers or entrances have ever been found into the monuments, and no tools have been found in the vicinity to clearly indicate human involvement. Many assert that the formations can be attributed to erosion or coral settlements. The sharp angles and lines in the stone may be the result of the way the stones erode-- breaking off at right angles. One can look to the cliffs above the sea to observe that the regional stone tends to erode in a way that leaves naturally sharp angles.

Perhaps the most reasonable theory, however, is one which suggests that the mounds of stone are natural features that were carved and shaped into terraces by early man. This theory adequately explains the lack of entrance into the monuments, and the apparent post holes and etchings made in the rock.

Because of the submerged location and the strong currents in the area, the Yonaguni Monuments have proved difficult to properly study; though the area has become a popular site for SCUBA tours. Researchers have not yet found conclusive evidence implicating either erosion or humanity as the source of these shapes, so the investigation and debate regarding the nature of the Yonaguni Monuments continues.

Article written by Jason Bellows, published on 17 November 2006. Jason is a contributing editor for DamnInteresting.com.

Article design by Alan Bellows. Edited by Alan Bellows.
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80 Comments
Dispatch
Posted 17 November 2006 at 11:43 am

Wow DI seems strange we still do not truly know the true extent of past civilisations and how they dissappeared, makes you wonder when our civilisation will end


levitysea
Posted 17 November 2006 at 11:47 am

There was a show on this on the Discovery channel just a few months ago, very amazing but it sure does seem inconclusive on the whole. I mean 200 ft below water, that seems easy enough to get down there and figure it out!


cerebulon
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:12 pm

I've become really skeptical of discoveries like this. I've studied unexplained phenomena since I was a young boy. More often than not underwater "ruins" are shown to be naturally formed. It would be awesome if it were true, though.


BrianTung
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:19 pm

I wonder if there are any other places of undisputed natural origins that exhibit that kind of regular appearance. To me, it looks man-made, but if we could see other places that look man-made (but are generally agreed to be natural), that would place the burden on the man-made side of the fence.


MMP
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:22 pm

I'm not a conspiracy theory person, but those formations look so clearly man made, I can't believe that anyone doubts it. And if these structures have been underwater for so long, there would surely be much more to see buried beneath the silt on the ocean floor. Perhaps even entrances. Don't some of the great pyramids have entrances outside of their perimeters?


plum13sec
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:23 pm

I used to live in okinawa, i just left there but i never knew there were underwater ruins DI!


Bollo
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:24 pm

Sure this place isn't R'lyeh?


StevFlem
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:24 pm

I find it very interesting that "It seems that most every culture has a legend of a great society, ripe with wealth and wisdom, which is lost to the sea." As my thoughts wander around this topic, I wonder if these legends and stories originated at the same time/place, and that there was a real catastrophic event such as catastrophic earthquakes that split a single land mass into separate continents... and perhaps even flooded much/most/all of the known world at the time...

Of course such an event is an exercise in fantasy, as everyone knows that the continents began drifting apart so long ago that it was dinosaurs roaming around everywhere, and people were not even invented yet... and certainly couldn't have developed any kind of a spoken language by then... and yet there is that startling consistency of "legend" among peoples of the world... the details vary, but basically some technically advanced people living somewhere kind of far away were swallowed up by the sea...

Kinda interesting to think about...


ti83
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:46 pm

Wow, that is so cool. I expecially like the comment by StevFlem, "...and people were not even invented yet..." Ha! That makes me laugh for some reason.

On a serious note, I think it's interesting, regardless of it were man made or not, that the entire area was above sea level only 8,000 years ago. 200 feet of water is a lot of water, it seems like something catastophic had to happen for such a result, regardless of if it were a man made structure. DI, definitely DI.


brienhopkins
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:48 pm

We have the technology. We could get down there and dig it up. It's worth the trouble.


brienhopkins
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:52 pm

Perhaps there was an rich human civilization lost and drowned in the ocean due to a catastrophic unfortunate earth quake. It's not entirely impossible. Look at the 1906 San Fransisco Earth Quake. If an earthquake of that magnitude hit a small island at sea, it would be curtains for humanity on the island. Are there, or have there been, any fault lines near the Yonaguni Monuments?


HarleyHetz
Posted 17 November 2006 at 12:55 pm

brienhopkins said: "We have the technology. We could get down there and dig it up. It's worth the trouble."

But who is going to pay for it...that is the question!! :)


Romeo702
Posted 17 November 2006 at 01:00 pm

BrianTung said: "I wonder if there are any other places of undisputed natural origins that exhibit that kind of regular appearance. To me, it looks man-made, but if we could see other places that look man-made (but are generally agreed to be natural), that would place the burden on the man-made side of the fence."

In the early 1900's, famed American psychic Edgar Cayce predicted that evidence of the lost continent of Atlantis would appear in the Bahamas in 1968 or 1969. Curiously, in 1968 pilots photograhed from the air structures that looked like buildings, walls and roads under the waters off of Bimini island. Others have claimed to have seen pyramids and stone circles on the sea bed, but the only thing that has been confirmed for sure is what has become to be known as the Bimini Road.

Skeptics claim that the Bimini road is a natural formation, even though it is a unique one. And there is no denying, the "roads" are straight and look man made. Perhaps they are even part of a wall that has fallen or part of a larger buried structure.


Leighther
Posted 17 November 2006 at 01:26 pm

The Giant's Causeway is quite a good example of a natural feature that looks man-made

http://images.google.co.uk/images?q=giant%27s+causeway

It's apparently the result of geological shearing forces and the crystalline nature of the rock formation,
or something.

Interesting to think about what man-made things may have been lost due to rising sea levels, coastal erosion, desertification etc.


Jason Bellows
Posted 17 November 2006 at 01:36 pm

Romeo702 said: "In the early 1900's, famed American psychic Edgar Cayce predicted that evidence of the lost continent of Atlantis would appear in the Bahamas in 1968 or 1969. Curiously, in 1968 pilots photograhed from the air structures that looked like buildings, walls and roads under the waters off of Bimini island. Others have claimed to have seen pyramids and stone circles on the sea bed, but the only thing that has been confirmed for sure is what has become to be known as the Bimini Road.

Skeptics claim that the Bimini road is a natural formation, even though it is a unique one. And there is no denying, the "roads" are straight and look man made. Perhaps they are even part of a wall that has fallen or part of a larger buried structure."

Do you mean this story: http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=274?


ByTheSea
Posted 17 November 2006 at 01:38 pm

StevFlem said: "I find it very interesting that "It seems that most every culture has a legend of a great society, ripe with wealth and wisdom, which is lost to the sea." As my thoughts wander around this topic, I wonder if these legends and stories originated at the same time/place, and that there was a real catastrophic event such as catastrophic earthquakes that split a single land mass into separate continents… and perhaps even flooded much/most/all of the known world at the time…

Since histories were once passed on orally, details changed over the years, and eventually the history became myth. No one knew what exactly was fact, or what had been embellished. So maybe there's a little truth in alot of the myths... we just don't know what it is.

Morgan Llywellen has a great (short) novel called "The Elementals." It explores how catastrophic events can change the face of the world.


ByTheSea
Posted 17 November 2006 at 01:44 pm

StevFlem said: "I find it very interesting that "It seems that most every culture has a legend of a great society, ripe with wealth and wisdom, which is lost to the sea." As my thoughts wander around this topic, I wonder if these legends and stories originated at the same time/place, and that there was a real catastrophic event such as catastrophic earthquakes that split a single land mass into separate continents… and perhaps even flooded much/most/all of the known world at the time…


Kinda interesting to think about…"

Since histories were once passed on orally, details changed over the years, and eventually the history became myth. No one knew what exactly was fact, or what had been embellished. So maybe there's a little truth in alot of the myths... we just don't know what it is.

Morgan Llywellen has a great (short) novel called "The Elementals." It explores how catastrophic events can change the face of the world.


fuzzhammer
Posted 17 November 2006 at 02:45 pm

you people are so stupid! the only possible explanation is the obvious one. MERMAIDS!!


James
Posted 17 November 2006 at 03:15 pm

It seams strange to me that this was discovered twenty years ago and it has not been studied at greater length other than by tourists. You would think some anthropologist from some university would get a grant to go study this. (Which is not that hard to do or at least not far fetched) there is a lot of money floating around out there for this kind of stuff. It has the potential to turn a lot of accepted theories on their head. I’m not saying that there is a conspiracy here but sometimes it is hard to go against an already established idea. There could be other explanations for it but the pictures that are here sure look manmade to me.


NeonCat
Posted 17 November 2006 at 03:20 pm

I'm not sure that mermaids and mermen would need stairs.


ChickenHead
Posted 17 November 2006 at 03:26 pm

The last relative Ice Age was generally believed by geologists to have come to an end roughly 10,000 years ago. All the water trapped in ice prior to that time was being released back into the oceans. Prior to that, the sea levels were lower, thus allowing for "costal" cities to be built in areas that are now under water. As with current times and through out all recorded human history, the most advanced (at least economically and technologically) parts of our societies have been costal cities. That is and was, until "The Silicon Age", just a facet of how commerce and technology spread fastest; via waterways.

So you have these ancient tropical "cities" that were probably better off than their inland neighbors. In the day of storytelling equals social knowledge that others have mentioned, places like that probably seemed magical to outsiders. And then they were eventually wiped out by the rising sea levels. Their stories and cultures get spread around to the relocated areas. It's not the least bit surprising that all over the world (in areas near tropical regions that wouldn't have been to drastically effected by an Ice Age) there are ancient stories about "lost civilizations".

Are those sharp geometric shapes under water in those areas like the Yonaguni Monuments relics of these probably ancient coastal "cities"? Perhaps, or perhaps they are just unique geological formations. Either way, they are Damn Interesting.


BrianTung
Posted 17 November 2006 at 04:57 pm

ChickenHead said: So you have these ancient tropical "cities" that were probably better off than their inland neighbors. In the day of storytelling equals social knowledge that others have mentioned, places like that probably seemed magical to outsiders. And then they were eventually wiped out by the rising sea levels. Their stories and cultures get spread around to the relocated areas. It's not the least bit surprising that all over the world (in areas near tropical regions that wouldn't have been to drastically effected by an Ice Age) there are ancient stories about "lost civilizations".

Not to mention--The larger and more advanced cities seem to have clustered near major bodies of water, either large rivers or seas and oceans. They would probably have been prey to the same kinds of vices that trouble cities today (though obviously with somewhat different mechanisms!). When those cities disappeared, whether slowly or suddenly, there would be some notion of moral retribution attached to their demise. We would have myths much like the biblical Sodom and Gomorrah. I find it interesting that people are often unwilling to accept that certain things happen for reasons that have nothing to do with either how good they themselves are, or how bad other people are.


Prince
Posted 17 November 2006 at 05:57 pm

Ive been there, and i know it looks man made and what-not, but when you actually see it in person, its clear that, despite being amazing, its not man made.

i strongly recommend this as a vacation spot for any one who's interested in things that look like other things.


Kuz_Sam
Posted 17 November 2006 at 06:41 pm

I have one word to say to you all... Intelligence creates things that cannot be explained by intelligence


Kuz_Sam
Posted 17 November 2006 at 06:42 pm

wowsers...that sounded deep :-P


sulkykid
Posted 17 November 2006 at 07:05 pm

Kuz_Sam said: "I have one word to say to you all… Intelligence creates things that cannot be explained by intelligence"

I count nine


sulkykid
Posted 17 November 2006 at 07:19 pm

Prince said: "Ive been there, and i know it looks man made and what-not, but when you actually see it in person, its clear that, despite being amazing, its not man made.


i strongly recommend this as a vacation spot for any one who's interested in things that look like other things."

Yes, this appears to be one of those interesting natural places like the Pyramids of Stone Lake, Wisconsin or Bimini's Atlantis Road. This is a very cool, very interesting place, can't we just appreciate this for what it is?


fecalmatters
Posted 17 November 2006 at 08:18 pm

I thought that right angles didn't occur in nature. And if those shapes were caused by rocks breaking off, where are the pieces that broke off?


BrianTung
Posted 17 November 2006 at 08:40 pm

fecalmatters said: "I thought that right angles didn't occur in nature. And if those shapes were caused by rocks breaking off, where are the pieces that broke off?"

Right angles happen all the time in nature. Salt crystals are a common example; they're cubic crystals (with no face-centered or body-centered additions), and cleave along planes at right angles.

As far as the pieces that broke off, they could easily have broken off before the whole structure was submerged.


fecalmatters
Posted 17 November 2006 at 09:19 pm

You're right about salt and other crystals. But this is bigger than that, no? and not csytalline? and if the pieces broke off before, still, where are they? How were they cleared away?


Tink
Posted 17 November 2006 at 09:19 pm

Bollo said: "Sure this place isn't R'lyeh?"

Tell us about this place, please.

This Is cool.
Romeo702 mentions Edgar Cayce's predictions of Atlantis. And of course many writings have told of it.
I do think that somewhere/time on this earth that an intellegent civilization once existed as technologicaly advanced as we are. I think they destroyed the world (as it was then) with that knowledge.
We are the remanants of that race of people.
Ergo the missing link, mythological Atlantis, the division of the continants, unexplained wonders of geology, time warp places, etc.
Ok granted it is a far fetched idea, but what the hey, as good as any other proposed by the "it could only be this way" crowd.
Chow down! :)


Grope
Posted 17 November 2006 at 10:47 pm

If right angles are a natural phenomenon, how is it that the right angles here are vertical and horizontal, perpendicular and parallel to Earth's gravity? Why so convenient for walking and the making of walls? What's so 'natural' about that? Just asking.


BrianTung
Posted 17 November 2006 at 11:37 pm

Grope said: "If right angles are a natural phenomenon, how is it that the right angles here are vertical and horizontal, perpendicular and parallel to Earth's gravity? Why so convenient for walking and the making of walls? What's so 'natural' about that? Just asking."

I can't answer that definitively, of course. But I think Earth's gravity is exactly one major reason why the planes might be aligned the way they are. The point is that the fact that they are right angles is merely suggestive; it proves nothing. No one says they aren't suggestive. You just need another line of evidence for it to be more convincing.

fecalmatters said: "You're right about salt and other crystals. But this is bigger than that, no? and not csytalline? and if the pieces broke off before, still, where are they? How were they cleared away?"

Ten thousand years is a very long time. They could be anywhere. I have no idea, honestly. But you really can't say, "I don't know where they are; therefore, they must be man-made."

One must be patient with ambiguity. I'm in no rush to know whether it's man-made, but when we do know, we should have very good reasons for knowing.


Emmy
Posted 17 November 2006 at 11:39 pm

I would die right now..... If only I could know..............


brienhopkins
Posted 18 November 2006 at 12:06 am

sulkykid said: "Yes, this appears to be one of those interesting natural places like the Pyramids of Stone Lake, Wisconsin or Bimini's Atlantis Road. This is a very cool, very interesting place, can't we just appreciate this for what it is?"

What it is?


zelden
Posted 18 November 2006 at 03:13 am

Kuz_Sam said: "I have one word to say to you all… Intelligence creates things that cannot be explained by intelligence"

typical yes, it seems that sometimes myths and history creates itself through the present time...


1c3d0g
Posted 18 November 2006 at 03:43 am

Awesome story!


jkschlitz
Posted 18 November 2006 at 08:02 am

Bollo said: "Sure this place isn't R'lyeh?"

Tink said: "Tell us about this place, please."

From Wikipedia: "R'lyeh is a fictional city that first appeared in the writings of H. P. Lovecraft. R'lyeh is also referred to in Lovecraft's "The Mound" as Relex. R'lyeh is a sunken city located deep under the Pacific Ocean and is where the godlike being Cthulhu is buried."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R'lyeh


jkschlitz
Posted 18 November 2006 at 08:07 am

levitysea said: "There was a show on this on the Discovery channel just a few months ago, very amazing but it sure does seem inconclusive on the whole. I mean 200 ft below water, that seems easy enough to get down there and figure it out!"

As it said in the article, "Because of the submerged location and the strong currents in the area, the Yonaguni Monuments have proved difficult to properly study..."

I would imagine the currents hamper study more than the...er..."underwaterness."


Nonesuch
Posted 18 November 2006 at 08:07 am

Emmy said: "I would die right now….. If only I could know………….."

An excellent candidate to be first on the list of good reasons not to know everything I should think, with second perhaps being the reading of DI articles...


another viewpoint
Posted 18 November 2006 at 10:37 am

fuzzhammer said: "you people are so stupid! the only possible explanation is the obvious one. MERMAIDS!!"

...way to go fuzzhammer...rather, I would have chalked it up to something more clearly understood by the DI masses...something like "geological evolution". Then again, I don't want to get the evolutionaries something to beef about...again.

fecalmatters said: "You're right about salt and other crystals. But this is bigger than that, no? and not csytalline? and if the pieces broke off before, still, where are they? How were they cleared away?"

...I was thinking the same thing...where are the "geological tailings"? Can't imagine a cleaning crew went through once a week to pick up the shards.

Way to go DI...wish there was more info to swim thru!


Chory
Posted 18 November 2006 at 12:19 pm

The "geological tailings" could very well be buried... Plus, as BrianTung said, 10,000 years is a long time. They could be anywhere and everywhere, especially in an area of strong currents.

I like stories like this, very interesting.


Drakvil
Posted 18 November 2006 at 12:20 pm

There are right angles in rock formations in Yosemite... at times. Every so often a piece of cliff face calves off and the part that's left on the face has a right angle.

I know what happened to the broken off pieces... when the thing submerged, they just floated away!

[joke] and R'lyeh? There they go bringing religion into it again! [/joke]


adastra
Posted 18 November 2006 at 03:07 pm

Prince said: "Ive been there, and i know it looks man made and what-not, but when you actually see it in person, its clear that, despite being amazing, its not man made.

Thank you Prince. It's great to hear from someone who's been there. I've dived the "Bimini Road" and it, too, is not man-made. Photos are one thing, but you see it in person...


Tink
Posted 18 November 2006 at 05:47 pm

jkschlitz said: "From Wikipedia: "R'lyeh is a fictional city that first appeared in the writings of H. P. Lovecraft. R'lyeh is also referred to in Lovecraft's "The Mound" as Relex. R'lyeh is a sunken city located deep under the Pacific Ocean and is where the godlike being Cthulhu is buried."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R'lyeh"

Thanks for the link, LOL, I been duped again . You guys are great!


ryuthrowsstuff
Posted 18 November 2006 at 06:00 pm

they way you apply the different names for lost continents is either outright wrong or misleading. As far as i understand it most of these names are not region specific, or derived from the regions they refer to. Prime example Lemuria. Lemuria refers to a continent that supposedly existed in the Indian ocean or the south pacific. The name, and legend, does not come from either India or the south pacific. The name was coined by western biologists who sought to explain why there were lemurs in India and the south east Asia, but no where in between. Before plate tectonics and pangea were accepted as an adequate explanation, the only foreseeable explanation was a continent that existed in the Indian ocean. The biologist named this land mass Lemuria after the adore mentioned lemurs. Later as the occultism movement seized on the concept in much the same way as they had Atlantis. So as far as I understand it most of the myths having to do with lost continents with their fabulous lost civilizations are not only western but fairly modern (Mu included).


crispi
Posted 19 November 2006 at 02:37 am

Looks pretty man-made to me.

There was a "super" volcano that erupted around 10,000 years ago in Indonesia. Far bigger than the Krakatoa eruption. It created a huge crater that is now the largest freshwater lake in the region and the dominating feature of the island of Sumatra. I wonder if it had anything to do with these structures being under water now. Or is it just coincidence that they were high and dry 8 to 10 thousand years ago.


inmyopinion
Posted 19 November 2006 at 11:12 am

Not to be a square, but it is reminiscent of stone outcroppings where blocks where removed to make constructions.

Such outcroppings usually will have triangular blocks taken out of them, until they assume a more-or-less pyramid shaped form, with the base (ofcourse) larger than the top.

The cutting and location of the cutting determined by what the required dimensions where for the different stone blocks and whether the outcropping possessed uniform quality: thus the outcropping turned progressively more asymmetrical.

See here a few small scale examples
http://www.econ.surrey.ac.uk/staff/rpierse/photos/stone.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/glendavidshort/sahuite.jpg

Ofcourse, that doesnt make the story less interesting. If it isnt coincidental and stones where harvested, what was built? A city? A temple? And where is it? Logically it should be nearby.


uncle frogy
Posted 19 November 2006 at 01:02 pm

ryuthrowsstuff said: "they way you apply the different names for lost continents is either outright wrong or misleading. As far as i understand it most of these names are not region specific, or derived from the regions they refer to. Prime example Lemuria. Lemuria refers to a continent that supposedly existed in the Indian ocean or the south pacific. The name, and legend, does not come from either India or the south pacific. The name was coined by western biologists who sought to explain why there were lemurs in India and the south east Asia, but no where in between. Before plate tectonics and pangea were accepted as an adequate explanation, the only foreseeable explanation was a continent that existed in the Indian ocean. The biologist named this land mass Lemuria after the adore mentioned lemurs. Later as the occultism movement seized on the concept in much the same way as they had Atlantis. So as far as I understand it most of the myths having to do with lost continents with their fabulous lost civilizations are not only western but fairly modern (Mu included)."

As has been said earlier the interesting thing about "lost civilizations" and the search for them and the interpretation of data as evidence of same is the need to look for them at all. The belief that it was better in the past is not applied only to the distant past but to the more recent past i.e. '50's for example.


Rev. Jack
Posted 19 November 2006 at 02:07 pm

Anthropologists keep pushing the age of the human race further and further back. Modern humans have been around for a very long time. I have no problem believing that perhaps several great civilization rose and fell before what we call recorded history.

From the Enuma Elish, to the book of Genesis, to the tales of Atlantis, to the stories of nearly every Pacific Island culture and some hints in Mezo-American mythology- all and more agree that human beings in the distant past were far more advanced than we give them credit for. (Not as advanced as us- I think- but settled and civilized.)

Unless, of course, you buy the party line that human beings wandered the planet for hundreds of thousands of years without amassing any significant knowledge level or cultural accomplishments.

Besides- has anyone ever considered the possibility that ancient peoples may have loved the planet enough to only develop environmentally friendly tools and techniques- the sorts of things which bio-degrade and don't many artifacts. Just a thought.


erikmartin
Posted 19 November 2006 at 09:29 pm

Just to clarify, because the article doesn't spell it out, and some people are not getting it. Anytime beyond 8,000-10,000 years ago, there was still enough of the earth's water trapped in the glaciers covering the earth from the Ice Age, that the ocean level was 200 or more feet lower that where it is now. So if this site was used it was more than 8,000 years ago, because that's the latest it could have still been above water (due to that pesky ancient global warming).

Our ignorance of prehistoric human civilization is VAST. We didn't go from being animals in caves to crawl out and simultaneously invent the Egyptian, Sumerian, Indus Valley, and Chinese cultures. There is a rich history there to be discovered. And yes, a lot of that history is inevitably underwater, such as the vast plains that used to surround what are now the islands of Indonesia.


erikmartin
Posted 19 November 2006 at 09:36 pm

So as far as I understand it most of the myths having to do with lost continents with their fabulous lost civilizations are not only western but fairly modern (Mu included)."

Atlantis is not Western or modern. The West knows it from Plato, but Plato learned the story from Egyptian Priests. (However, I have no doubt that Plato added plenty of nonsense to what he heard.)


infonote
Posted 20 November 2006 at 01:40 am

The oldest confirmed "buildings" made by humans are located in the Island of Malta.

http://www.heritagemalta.org/heritagesites.html


Prince
Posted 20 November 2006 at 03:37 am

ErikMartin: Plato claimed he learnt it from his grandfather, who learnt it from his grandfather, who learnt it from Solon the law maker, who learnt it from Egyptian priests.


Romeo702
Posted 20 November 2006 at 07:33 am

infonote said: "The oldest confirmed "buildings" made by humans are located in the Island of Malta.


http://www.heritagemalta.org/heritagesites.html"

Does anyone know what they were called or when they were built? The only info I can find is on The Malta Temple which is the oldest building *still standing* and was built in 4000 BC. Egypt has that beat by at least two thousand years.


Griffin
Posted 20 November 2006 at 01:49 pm

Tink said: "Tell us about this place, please.

This Is cool.

Romeo702 mentions Edgar Cayce's predictions of Atlantis. And of course many writings have told of it.

I do think that somewhere/time on this earth that an intellegent civilization once existed as technologicaly advanced as we are. I think they destroyed the world (as it was then) with that knowledge.

We are the remanants of that race of people.

Ergo the missing link, mythological Atlantis, the division of the continants, unexplained wonders of geology, time warp places, etc.

Ok granted it is a far fetched idea, but what the hey, as good as any other proposed by the "it could only be this way" crowd.

Chow down! :)"

As strange as Tink's idea sounds, when all other possibities are eliminated this one remains the most plausiable. Especially, if our planet undergoes some kind of cyclical catastrophic cleansing every 26,000 years of so, which involves the switch of the magnetic poles. This would induce all kinds of earthquakes, floods, and general destruction to all organic matter during the period we lack of a magnetic shield.

Its not to hard to imagine that happening to our culture and find that very few survive. It's also possible that the infestation that now grows on the surface of this planet could be the cause or catalyst for our planet in conjunction with the sun (solar flares) undergoing a cleansing cycle. Plus, civilizations that now infest this planet are pretty easy to wipe out since they are most built upon a 'house of cards', unlike the orginal populations which built in stone, ours would soon vanish if left underwater for any period of time.
Just an idea.


J. Richard Niemela
Posted 20 November 2006 at 08:32 pm

This is most associated with those humans from the pre-deluge time...It is understood that the world was populated by humans from the depictions of Genesis 1...the man and woman, assigned to "replenish' the earth..What is most associated with these stone buildings comes from a book titled, THE THREE WORLDS that speaks to the earth being flooded and these sites covered by 3 miles of water..The author is E.T. Tennyson..and the booklet is available from The Association of Covenant People P.O. Box 1478, Ferndale, WA. 98248....JRN


Silverhill
Posted 21 November 2006 at 12:15 am

Griffin said: "As strange as Tink's idea sounds, when all other possibities are eliminated this one remains the most plausiable. Especially, if our planet undergoes some kind of cyclical catastrophic cleansing every 26,000 years of so, which involves the switch of the magnetic poles. This would induce all kinds of earthquakes, floods, and general destruction to all organic matter during the period we lack of a magnetic shield.

There is indeed a history of magnetic-field reversal on/in Earth, but it would be difficult to call it "cyclic". From the relevant Wikipedia entry: "Based upon the study of lava flows of basalt throughout the world, it has been proposed that the Earth's magnetic field reverses at intervals, ranging from tens of thousands to many millions of years, with an average interval of approximately 250,000 years. The last such event, called the Brunhes-Matuyama reversal, is theorized to have occurred some 780,000 years ago."

"It's also possible that the infestation that now grows on the surface of this planet could be the cause or catalyst for our planet in conjunction with the sun (solar flares) undergoing a cleansing cycle. ... Just an idea."

Just a bad idea, IMHO. The biosphere does not cause or catalyze "cleansing cycles" (whatever those may be), with or without solar flares' help. (Nor do solar flares "cleanse" the planet.)Now, as far as that "infestation" notion of yours...you need to work on that self-image, Griffin. Life is not inherently an "infestation" of Earth!


Drakvil
Posted 21 November 2006 at 12:52 am

J. Richard Niemela said: "... that speaks to the earth being flooded and these sites covered by 3 miles of water."

Gee, and we're worried about global warming raising the sea levels a measly 3 feet? How many mountains are taller than the odd 17,000 feet you mention? If both polar caps were melted and all the ambient humidity in the air were condensed into rain, it would only be enough to raise the water levels about 30 feet or so (rough estimate from the time the movie "Waterworld" came out).

Silverhill said: "... Life is not inherently an "infestation" of Earth!"

I think V'ger would disagree with you there... all these carbon based units infesting the third planet are interfering with "The Creator" communicating with V'ger.


Kao_Valin
Posted 21 November 2006 at 10:15 am

Drakvil said: "Gee, and we're worried about global warming raising the sea levels a measly 3 feet? How many mountains are taller than the odd 17,000 feet you mention? If both polar caps were melted and all the ambient humidity in the air were condensed into rain, it would only be enough to raise the water levels about 30 feet or so (rough estimate from the time the movie "Waterworld" came out).

Its more than just the water level rising. Water levels effect how much solar radiation is absorbed and reflected. Also the drop in plant life drops oxygen levels further (less land). Then there are all those places that would flood and be submerged. Eventually there would be another Ice Age. This is because the heat created during the global warming would release methane into the atmosphere (currently frozen in the oceans). If i remember the chain reactions correctly, this would result in a vast cooling and eventually freeze the planet.

However the events leading up to this would wipe clean a lot of the dry land. High powered hurricanes (powered by the increase in heat over larger area of water). Likewise droughts would happen in otherwise fertile places as displacement and life cycles are dramatically effected. El Nino would return and stay there causing havoc in indonesian areas.

One has to think about more than just the direct effects of rising waters and increases in temprature. There are secondary run away effects that can occur as a result. That is why global warming is so bad. Most may know about these things, but it is to benifit others to at least consider it who dont already know of these results.


azngeek714
Posted 23 November 2006 at 05:12 pm

The ancient trinkets of the Knights Who Say "Mu"


Byrden
Posted 24 November 2006 at 02:40 am

I believe that these ruins were carved by an ancient civilization, and that their purpose was a theme park for scuba divers.


Tink
Posted 24 November 2006 at 07:05 am

azngeek714 said: "The ancient trinkets of the Knights Who Say "Mu""

Byrden said: "I believe that these ruins were carved by an ancient civilization, and that their purpose was a theme park for scuba divers."

LOL , it's great to see more folks with a clever laugh to share.
So it looks like we have another mystery to ponder.
I guess you could say we have muved over Atlantis and dived into this deep subject heads first. Am bubbling over with anticipation and holding my breath for the next comment. :-)


Tink
Posted 28 November 2006 at 07:29 pm

Hey, look at this. I found a link and picture of Mu writing on Anomalies Unlimited.com

Check it out! Oh and JustDave and Shandooga, you guys will LOVE this site, I'm sure! LOL
http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Alien%20Writing/Mu.html


labouton
Posted 29 November 2006 at 06:42 pm

I have a cow that says mu.


Tink
Posted 29 November 2006 at 09:27 pm

labouton said: "I have a cow that says mu."

LOL. wiping coffee off the screen now. You may like this:
http://gprime.net/flash.php/cowswithguns


veekay
Posted 03 December 2006 at 12:07 am

Sometimes legends are forerunners to scientific truths.

Take the case of "DVARAKA", the legendary lost city of Lord Krishna ("The Protector", one of the "Holy Trinity" in the Hindu pantheon of gods).

According to the Mahabharata (one of the Sanskrit epics of Hindu mythology), the city of DVARAKA with its amazing wealth & splendour, was submerged by the sea, shortly after Lord Krishna left for the heavenly abode.

FYI, there is actually a city called as "Dwarka" on the west coast of India. But the search for the lost city of legend, has been going on since 1930's. The Marine Archaeology Unit (MAU) of the National Institute of Oceanography, took part in this search in 1983. This search was carried out in the coastal waters of Dwarka in Gujarat.

Explorations between 1983 and 1990 revealed the well-fortified township of Dvaraka, that extended more than half a mile from the shore. The township was built in six sectors along the banks of a river. The foundation of boulders on which the city's walls were erected proves that the land was reclaimed from the sea.

Dvaraka extended up to Bet Dwaraka (Sankhodhara) in the north and Okhamadhi in the south. Eastward it extended up to Pindara. The general layout of the city of Dvaraka described in ancient texts agrees with that of the submerged city discovered by MAU.

Offshore explorations near present Bet Dwarka brought to light a number of stone anchors of different types that include triangular, grapnel and ring stones. They are made out of locally available rocks and their period may also be similar to those found at Dwarka and other places. Recently, Roman antiquities including sherds of amphorae and a lead ingot and lead anchors were found. There is also an indication of a shipwreck of Roman period in Bet Dwarka waters.

Read more about Krishna's Dwarka here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwarka

Sometimes legends can point towards scientific facts. ;-)


Tink
Posted 05 December 2006 at 09:56 pm

That is very cool Veekay, thanks!


remkitty
Posted 15 December 2006 at 08:55 am

There's a great book on this and other under-water "ruins" and their possible implications -- Underworld: The Mysterious Origins of Civilization, by Graham Hancock. It is obvious from the title what the author's point of view is, but he makes a decent case for it. As an added bonus, he goes through the trouble of personally diving (or attempting to dive) many of the sites.


bibliophilia
Posted 08 January 2007 at 10:49 am

This isn't exactly related, but it amazes me how many people use wikipedia as a credible source. Am I mistaken in thinking that as an opensource kind of idea that anyone can go and change, it shouldn't be taken for granted that everything wiki has to say is correct?


Megadeus
Posted 21 February 2007 at 07:41 am

brienhopkins said: "Perhaps there was an rich human civilization lost and drowned in the ocean due to a catastrophic unfortunate earth quake. It's not entirely impossible. Look at the 1906 San Fransisco Earth Quake. If an earthquake of that magnitude hit a small island at sea, it would be curtains for humanity on the island. Are there, or have there been, any fault lines near the Yonaguni Monuments?"

Yonaguni-Shima lies almost in the middle between the Ryukyu Trench and the Philippine Trench along the most seismically active place on Earth, the Pacific Ring of Fire, which encircles the rim of the Pacific basin. Approximately 90% of the worlds earthquakes occur along the Pacific Ring of Fire. During the last Ice Age, Yonaguni, Japan, and the Philippines would have been part of the Asian continent.

bibliophilia said: "This isn't exactly related, but it amazes me how many people use wikipedia as a credible source. Am I mistaken in thinking that as an opensource kind of idea that anyone can go and change, it shouldn't be taken for granted that everything wiki has to say is correct?"

Although it is certainly possible for just about anyone who pleases to go and change whatever they want on Wikipedia, the percentage of knowledgeable, responsible, and dedicated people tends to outweigh the number of those who unwittingly or knowingly submit misinformation and Wikipedia does restrict or revoke editing rights for IPs that repeatedly submit bad information. Furthermore, with the sheer number of dedicated editors, poor content does not tend to remain up for very long, especially on the larger entries, often being rewritten or reverted back to a previous correct version within hours or minutes. There is, of course, always a small chance you might happen to visit the entry during a time of disrepair, that is why Wikipedia encourages you to continue your research beyond the article by providing references and external links for further reading. For the most part, I find Wikipedia to be just as reliable, if not more so, than other sources of information. At least you know Wikipedia entries are a collaboration of peers, rather than the word of perhaps a single expert of unknown validity.


spaceshib
Posted 11 May 2007 at 10:42 am

inmyopinion said: "Not to be a square, but it is reminiscent of stone outcroppings where blocks where removed to make constructions.

Such outcroppings usually will have triangular blocks taken out of them, until they assume a more-or-less pyramid shaped form, with the base (ofcourse) larger than the top.

The cutting and location of the cutting determined by what the required dimensions where for the different stone blocks and whether the outcropping possessed uniform quality: thus the outcropping turned progressively more asymmetrical.

See here a few small scale examples

http://www.econ.surrey.ac.uk/staff/rpierse/photos/stone.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/glendavidshort/sahuite.jpg

Ofcourse, that doesnt make the story less interesting. If it isnt coincidental and stones where harvested, what was built? A city? A temple? And where is it? Logically it should be nearby."

i hate to be a square,

but the first pic you posted isn't the remains of quarrying, it's the intihuatana stone on macchu picchu in peru. it is used to measure the angle of the sun and predict equinoxes/solstices.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=%22Intihuatana+Stone%22&btnG=Google+Search&meta=


EZer0
Posted 22 May 2007 at 03:10 am

Let us praise the Green One Cathooloo!


belyaun
Posted 29 September 2007 at 09:30 pm

Didn't some Japanese mangaka create a manga with these ruins in it anout scuba diving...


Pup
Posted 08 October 2007 at 10:02 pm

They look man made, from a lost civilization maybe. I also have difficulty visualizing these improbable right angles being formed under water. The currents are so strong, how can the angles be so perfect? With so much movement they would be more rounded not perfect 90 degree angles. That's just common sense. Very cool article!


HiEv
Posted 09 October 2007 at 09:42 am

Well, "common sense" also tells you that the Earth is flat, a heavy sphere falls faster than a light sphere, and that if X amount of a drug is good, then 2X is twice as good. All of that "common sense" is usually quite wrong when actually examined. Still these are not "perfect 90 degree angles," as you can see in the photos they're chipped and slightly rounded. Anyways, it wouldn't matter if they were formed under water or from a lost civilization, you would get the same wear pattern with either origin. Rocks both can and do break off at right angles under certain rare circumstances. See, for example, the similar Giant's Causeway (mentioned by Leighther above) which has rocks that break off in mostly hexagonal columns. Also, I grew up near Devils Tower (as seen in Close Encounters of the Third Kind), which has tremendous columns of rock with unusually straight edges. Both of those are natural formations, not the ruins of a lost civilization. This is why one has to be careful of "common sense," it can easily lead to error in areas with unusual, contradictory, or non-obvious information.

Finding a lost civilization is a pleasant, romantic idea, but how much you like an idea does not affect what is most probable based on all of the evidence.


Chris Anthony
Posted 08 July 2008 at 08:20 am

HiEv said: "Well, "common sense" also tells you that ... a heavy sphere falls faster than a light sphere..."

For what it's worth, common sense is actually right here. It's just not obviously right, and the scale of its rightness is so infinitesimal as to be functionally unobservable. If sphere A masses twice as much as sphere B, it will fall faster than sphere B - but it will be accelerating at something close to (sphere B's mass)*10^-17 m/s^2 faster. (10^-17m is about 1/100 the size of a single proton, so - like I said - it's functionally unobservable. But the increase is there.)


Mirage_GSM
Posted 01 October 2008 at 01:58 am

While right angles do form naturally, this area seems to have quite a few right angles very close together. I have no problem admitting our ancestors might have had the ability to create such a structure.
So, while I'm not sure the site was created artificially, I think it would be worth the trouble to have a closer look with adaequate equipment.


jackmagic
Posted 16 November 2009 at 04:27 am

of course there are lost civilisations! they all moved to the centre of the earth to live with the lizard people, occasionally sending out special agents to the surface, all named 'Bush' - the key word there is special


DeLuzional
Posted 24 November 2009 at 06:23 am

James said: "It seams strange to me that this was discovered twenty years ago and it has not been studied at greater length other than by tourists. You would think some anthropologist from some university would get a grant to go study this. (Which is not that hard to do or at least not far fetched) there is a lot of money floating around out there for this kind of stuff. It has the potential to turn a lot of accepted theories on their head. I’m not saying that there is a conspiracy here but sometimes it is hard to go against an already established idea. There could be other explanations for it but the pictures that are here sure look manmade to me."

My word! Its plain to me now, "we" are not studying it because "we" built it! Top secret Gov. base....


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