Comments on: The Rise and Fall of William J. Sidis http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis A collection of Damn Interesting things Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:41:34 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: JesseA http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-24646 JesseA Thu, 18 Jun 2009 04:02:02 +0000 #comment-24646 I haven't read an actual biography. I am wondering why we assume that he burned out? I read that he didn't want to be around people so much. He wanted to avoid the press, and he wanted to avoid the pressure, and pursue things that way he wanted to. Why do we assume that people who we acknowledge are smarter than us are always making bad decisions and need our guidance? Why do we assume that they have a burden to make use of their intelligence in ways that we will appreciate? I'm not saying that being smart is being correct. I'm actually not saying anything. These are questions that I've learned to ask subsequent to my mother telling me that I would be wasting myself if I pursued what I was telling her I was going to. "You could be a doctor, or a lawyer, or an engineer!" If you think of something better than those maybe you could tell my mom? Don't forget to realize that people at NASA are engineers, most politicians are lawyers, and being a brain surgeon isn't overlooked by the category doctor. I haven’t read an actual biography. I am wondering why we assume that he burned out? I read that he didn’t want to be around people so much. He wanted to avoid the press, and he wanted to avoid the pressure, and pursue things that way he wanted to.

Why do we assume that people who we acknowledge are smarter than us are always making bad decisions and need our guidance? Why do we assume that they have a burden to make use of their intelligence in ways that we will appreciate?

I’m not saying that being smart is being correct. I’m actually not saying anything. These are questions that I’ve learned to ask subsequent to my mother telling me that I would be wasting myself if I pursued what I was telling her I was going to. “You could be a doctor, or a lawyer, or an engineer!” If you think of something better than those maybe you could tell my mom? Don’t forget to realize that people at NASA are engineers, most politicians are lawyers, and being a brain surgeon isn’t overlooked by the category doctor.

]]> By: drogulous http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-22204 drogulous Sun, 20 Jul 2008 14:11:52 +0000 #comment-22204 To me it is a shame that success in life seems so frequently thought of in terms of publicly noted achievements. I think real success comes in the forms of things such as close relationships, mental and spiritual maturity, wisdom and happiness; none of which are publicly noted per se. Maybe his parents should have considered that from the start - it's not as if it's a new thought. To me it is a shame that success in life seems so frequently thought of in terms of publicly noted achievements. I think real success comes in the forms of things such as close relationships, mental and spiritual maturity, wisdom and happiness; none of which are publicly noted per se.

Maybe his parents should have considered that from the start – it’s not as if it’s a new thought.

]]> By: Anthropositor http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-21227 Anthropositor Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:55:58 +0000 #comment-21227 This story is not news to me. It actually played a part in the formation of a theory of mine, which I have not actively refined or polished, because its' consequences are not pleasant for me to contemplate. I got goaded into taking the Mensa qualification tests in the early eighties. My life at that time could have been termed "gregariously reclusive." On the night before the battery of tests, I partied hard, something which was quite uncommon for me. After about three hours of sleep, I blearily went to the testing location feeling two things: that I was going to fail, and a simultaneous sense of relief. Anyway, it was quite a good situation. I was certainly in no condition to come out well on the test, and my annoying Mensa buddies would be defeated. It was their position that, though most of my education was in the library and used book stores, there was a high chance I would score well. This would prove them wrong. It would settle the matter. So I went and relaxed, had fun with the tests, and went home quite confident of failure. In retrospect, I should have had less fun, and paid attention to what I was doing. I failed to fail. Okay, so I made the best of it, even going so far as to attend a half dozen Mensa banquets. (Having had some lean times as a youth, I an a soft touch for a banquet or Buffet. But I was out of place. Sort of a novelty among the PhD.'s and postdocs, whereas my formal education had fragments of eighth and ninth grade, and maybe even a few weeks of tenth. It is that out-of-placeness that struck me more than anything else. Mr. Sidis was a tragic figure because he was so precocious before he had discovered the need for not drawing attention to himself. He was a public figure before he was out of boyhood. Another example, whose name I no longer recall, is another obvious example. He was the subject of a 20-20 Downtown segment, sort of a news magazine style TV show. This could have been eight or ten years ago, yet the stroke of a few years ago hasn't seemed to fog out the show, other than his name. They had billed him as the man with the one-in-a-million IQ. That's what really caught my attention. I wanted to know how it worked out for him to have shown those three extra orders of magnitude on his ratio to the population. And my first thought was that it was great that they didn't just slap an IQ number on him, A number that pretends greater precision and meaning than it has. But that didn't work out. They did actually mention his numerical IQ during the story. He was being interviewed by a young lady who clearly displayed the perspective that anything this guy said HAD to be right. He was just to smart for it to be otherwise. That did not bode well for the interview. At one point he said that if there was more than a forty point spread between the IQ's of two people, communication between the two was not possible. which was patent nonsense. Then they showed some stuff on his computer screen which he was writing. Seemed sort of nonsensical to me. But to this young reporter, it was without question probably something great, and cosmically important. As far as I could tell, this guy had never actually done anything with his talent. His employment was as a bouncer in a topless bar. The story was pretty sparse beyond that. I had hoped she would ask him if he had an eidetic memory. Lot's of folks appear to be pretty bright just because they can remember great volumes of data. Now I'm not saying a good memory isn't useful, but in some ways, it may actually be a liability in terms of inventiveness and creativity. The thing to remember is that intelligence is not an end in and of itself. It is just the means to accomplish creative and inventive things with greater facility. Geniuses are actually less likely to gather great wealth, or attain high office, or do anything truly notable, than those bright people closer to the norms of intelligence. The exceptionally brilliant are, more often than not, not suited well to getting along in the real world. If they have any sense at all, they carefully watch out what ideas they choose to announce to others. Sounds selfish, I know. But Giordano Bruno would not have been burned at the stake without the benefit of the pre-strangulation which was considerately provided the usual crop of heretics. He spoke out of turn, and would not shut up. This story is not news to me. It actually played a part in the formation of a theory of mine, which I have not actively refined or polished, because its’ consequences are not pleasant for me to contemplate.

I got goaded into taking the Mensa qualification tests in the early eighties. My life at that time could have been termed “gregariously reclusive.” On the night before the battery of tests, I partied hard, something which was quite uncommon for me. After about three hours of sleep, I blearily went to the testing location feeling two things: that I was going to fail, and a simultaneous sense of relief. Anyway, it was quite a good situation. I was certainly in no condition to come out well on the test, and my annoying Mensa buddies would be defeated. It was their position that, though most of my education was in the library and used book stores, there was a high chance I would score well. This would prove them wrong. It would settle the matter.

So I went and relaxed, had fun with the tests, and went home quite confident of failure. In retrospect, I should have had less fun, and paid attention to what I was doing. I failed to fail.

Okay, so I made the best of it, even going so far as to attend a half dozen Mensa banquets. (Having had some lean times as a youth, I an a soft touch for a banquet or Buffet. But I was out of place. Sort of a novelty among the PhD.’s and postdocs, whereas my formal education had fragments of eighth and ninth grade, and maybe even a few weeks of tenth.

It is that out-of-placeness that struck me more than anything else.

Mr. Sidis was a tragic figure because he was so precocious before he had discovered the need for not drawing attention to himself. He was a public figure before he was out of boyhood.

Another example, whose name I no longer recall, is another obvious example. He was the subject of a 20-20 Downtown segment, sort of a news magazine style TV show. This could have been eight or ten years ago, yet the stroke of a few years ago hasn’t seemed to fog out the show, other than his name. They had billed him as the man with the one-in-a-million IQ. That’s what really caught my attention. I wanted to know how it worked out for him to have shown those three extra orders of magnitude on his ratio to the population. And my first thought was that it was great that they didn’t just slap an IQ number on him, A number that pretends greater precision and meaning than it has. But that didn’t work out. They did actually mention his numerical IQ during the story.

He was being interviewed by a young lady who clearly displayed the perspective that anything this guy said HAD to be right. He was just to smart for it to be otherwise. That did not bode well for the interview.

At one point he said that if there was more than a forty point spread between the IQ’s of two people, communication between the two was not possible. which was patent nonsense. Then they showed some stuff on his computer screen which he was writing. Seemed sort of nonsensical to me. But to this young reporter, it was without question probably something great, and cosmically important. As far as I could tell, this guy had never actually done anything with his talent. His employment was as a bouncer in a topless bar.

The story was pretty sparse beyond that. I had hoped she would ask him if he had an eidetic memory. Lot’s of folks appear to be pretty bright just because they can remember great volumes of data.

Now I’m not saying a good memory isn’t useful, but in some ways, it may actually be a liability in terms of inventiveness and creativity.

The thing to remember is that intelligence is not an end in and of itself. It is just the means to accomplish creative and inventive things with greater facility. Geniuses are actually less likely to gather great wealth, or attain high office, or do anything truly notable, than those bright people closer to the norms of intelligence. The exceptionally brilliant are, more often than not, not suited well to getting along in the real world. If they have any sense at all, they carefully watch out what ideas they choose to announce to others. Sounds selfish, I know. But Giordano Bruno would not have been burned at the stake without the benefit of the pre-strangulation which was considerately provided the usual crop of heretics. He spoke out of turn, and would not shut up.

]]> By: joe2005 http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-19161 joe2005 Tue, 25 Dec 2007 19:07:19 +0000 #comment-19161 Bellows is a good writer and wrote an interesting article. There does exist a difficulty, however, that the data within the article is mostly based on Amy Wallace's book "The Prodigy", which was not very accurate with its information. The 250-300 IQ claim may have begun as an exaggeration by Helena Sidis, William's sister. "The Prodigy" stated that Abraham Sperling personally gave William Sidis the IQ test, but Sperling stated in his own writing "The Story of Genius" that Helena told him a psychiatrist had given William the test and that the psychiatrist estimated the IQ to be about 250-300. Sperling's comment was based on hearsay, and it is unknown what reference that "The Prodigy" used for its version, or if "The Prodigy" simply invented the claim. To my knowledge there still does not exist any evidence nor first-hand record of William Sidis' IQ score. Nevertheless, no known adult IQ test can measure with reasonable accuracy above approximately 140-150 today (99.9%+-), and none existed in the 1940s. The older version of IQ testing that used the formula of IQ=mental age x chronological age was useful for measuring children, and a 250-300 IQ score can be reasonably valid for children, but not for adults. Nevertheless, IQ scores do not accurately reflect intelligence, and neither can an IQ score be used for the claim that William Sidis was the smartest man on earth. Sidis may have been the smartest man on earth, we will never know, but an IQ score will not be the deciding factor. Many speculations exist about Sidis, very few of which are based on evidence. The most damaging of speculations have been the interpretations of prodigious talents by individuals who are not themselves a prodigy and therefore cannot recognize why some prodigies make some choices in life. Also, very seldom are questions asked of the prodigy himself, and it is wrong to invent answers for questions never asked. It is an error to invent a claim about anyone or anything without sufficient evidence. http://www.angelfire.com/home/sesquiq/2007sesquiqmyths.html Bellows is a good writer and wrote an interesting article. There does exist a difficulty, however, that the data within the article is mostly based on Amy Wallace’s book “The Prodigy”, which was not very accurate with its information. The 250-300 IQ claim may have begun as an exaggeration by Helena Sidis, William’s sister. “The Prodigy” stated that Abraham Sperling personally gave William Sidis the IQ test, but Sperling stated in his own writing “The Story of Genius” that Helena told him a psychiatrist had given William the test and that the psychiatrist estimated the IQ to be about 250-300. Sperling’s comment was based on hearsay, and it is unknown what reference that “The Prodigy” used for its version, or if “The Prodigy” simply invented the claim. To my knowledge there still does not exist any evidence nor first-hand record of William Sidis’ IQ score. Nevertheless, no known adult IQ test can measure with reasonable accuracy above approximately 140-150 today (99.9%+-), and none existed in the 1940s. The older version of IQ testing that used the formula of IQ=mental age x chronological age was useful for measuring children, and a 250-300 IQ score can be reasonably valid for children, but not for adults. Nevertheless, IQ scores do not accurately reflect intelligence, and neither can an IQ score be used for the claim that William Sidis was the smartest man on earth. Sidis may have been the smartest man on earth, we will never know, but an IQ score will not be the deciding factor.

Many speculations exist about Sidis, very few of which are based on evidence. The most damaging of speculations have been the interpretations of prodigious talents by individuals who are not themselves a prodigy and therefore cannot recognize why some prodigies make some choices in life. Also, very seldom are questions asked of the prodigy himself, and it is wrong to invent answers for questions never asked. It is an error to invent a claim about anyone or anything without sufficient evidence.

http://www.angelfire.com/home/sesquiq/2007sesquiqmyths.html

]]> By: Jeff☠Relf http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-18173 Jeff☠Relf Mon, 05 Nov 2007 08:54:33 +0000 #comment-18173 Hmm... I can't submit comments using FireFox 2.0 and: “ userContent.CSS ” in “ www.Cotse.NET/users/jeffrelf/Games.ZIP ”. The Previewer isn't faithful to the final outcome. Also, I doubt that these tags work: Hmm… I can’t submit comments using FireFox 2.0 and:
“ userContent.CSS ” in “ http://www.Cotse.NET/users/jeffrelf/Games.ZIP ”.

The Previewer isn’t faithful to the final outcome.
Also, I doubt that these tags work:

]]> By: Jeff☠Relf http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-18172 Jeff☠Relf Mon, 05 Nov 2007 08:42:05 +0000 #comment-18172 Oops... the link above is broken, make that: “ http://WikiPedia.ORG/wiki/Eternalism_%28philosophy_of_time%29 ”. Oops… the link above is broken, make that:
“ http://WikiPedia.ORG/wiki/Eternalism_%28philosophy_of_time%29 ”.

]]> By: Jeff☠Relf http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-18167 Jeff☠Relf Sun, 04 Nov 2007 17:21:16 +0000 #comment-18167 [ Continuing my earlier comment ] ...otherwise we wouldn't be here. Sidis got it right. Compared to the above logic, the Bible's views are childish and less beneficial to humanity. Sidis only lent his name to one book: “ The Animate and the Inanimate ”. From the book: “ if we come to the conclusion that the second law of thermodynamics is fundamentally based on a conceptual illusion, it would be just as logical to admit the same possibility for the other physical laws, in which case the theory of the reversibility of the universe would almost carry with it its own retaliation, since the reversible physical laws are the foundation of that theory. If observed facts can be explained in one case as a conceptual illusion, why not in another case ? ”. Here, Sidis' theory was wrong. What Sidis didn't know ( and couldn't have known ) was that, because outer-reaches of our observable Universe are expanding away from us faster than light, we'll never see them. The cosmos is forever cooling, I assume, and exploitable energy is constantly diminishing. In other words, the second law of thermodynamics, like all the laws of physics, is truly cosmic in scope. “ Life ” is merely a form of consumption, there's nothing special about the temperature that habors water, and life will continue to evolve no matter how cold and dark the cosmos becomes. Returning to Sidis' comment: “ Evolution is my God. ”, people only worship rich dudes, I imagine. If you got money, you're their lord. We lick the crap off the rich dude's boots, and then jump the homeless, drug addled thief, to cull the herd. But, as we worship the rich and cull the weak, let's not forget: consuming more just means dying that much sooner. If it wasn't for ignorance, we'd see time for what it really is: a spatial dimension; but, thanks to ignorance, time seems directional, when, in fact, the future is just as fixed as the past. For more on this, see: “ http://WikiPedia.ORG/wiki/Eternalism_(philosophy_of_time) ”. [ Continuing my earlier comment ]

…otherwise we wouldn’t be here. Sidis got it right.

Compared to the above logic,
the Bible’s views are childish and less beneficial to humanity.

Sidis only lent his name to one book:
“ The Animate and the Inanimate ”.

From the book:
“ if we come to the conclusion that the second law of thermodynamics
is fundamentally based on a conceptual illusion,

it would be just as logical to admit
the same possibility for the other physical laws,

in which case the theory of the reversibility of the universe
would almost carry with it its own retaliation,
since the reversible physical laws are the foundation of that theory.

If observed facts can be explained in one case as
a conceptual illusion, why not in another case ? ”.

Here, Sidis’ theory was wrong.

What Sidis didn’t know ( and couldn’t have known ) was that,
because outer-reaches of our observable Universe
are expanding away from us faster than light, we’ll never see them.

The cosmos is forever cooling, I assume,
and exploitable energy is constantly diminishing.

In other words, the second law of thermodynamics,
like all the laws of physics, is truly cosmic in scope.

“ Life ” is merely a form of consumption,
there’s nothing special about the temperature that habors water,
and life will continue to evolve
no matter how cold and dark the cosmos becomes.

Returning to Sidis’ comment: “ Evolution is my God. ”,
people only worship rich dudes, I imagine.
If you got money, you’re their lord.

We lick the crap off the rich dude’s boots,
and then jump the homeless, drug addled thief, to cull the herd.

But, as we worship the rich and cull the weak, let’s not forget:
consuming more just means dying that much sooner.

If it wasn’t for ignorance, we’d see time for what it really is:
a spatial dimension; but, thanks to ignorance, time seems directional,
when, in fact, the future is just as fixed as the past.

For more on this, see:
“ http://WikiPedia.ORG/wiki/Eternalism_(philosophy_of_time) ”.

]]> By: Jeff☠Relf http://www.damninteresting.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-william-j-sidis#comment-18166 Jeff☠Relf Sun, 04 Nov 2007 17:17:01 +0000 #comment-18166 To a large extent, education obviates the need for money. Further, more educated nations can afford a lower birth rate. William J. Sidis was nothing, if not educated. At his 1919 trial, when he was 21, he said something like: “ Evolution is my God. ”. Q. What did that get him ? A. A year of torture in his dad's mental institution plus a year of house arrest in California. [ According to Bill Sidis, he was ruthlessly tortured both day and night ] I too say “ Evolution is my God. ”, so I highly appreciate Sidis' public assertion. Society needs more people like him, I maintain. Q. Why did Stalin ( and, to a lesser extent, Bush and Clinton ) Lord ( like “ Gods ” ) over proverbial and/or litteral “ death camp forced labor ” ? A. To promote their genes. Is it any wonder than, that Sidis was a “ Consciencious Objector ” ? As I see it, forwarding one's genes does not constitute a genuine purpose, it's merely --> something that happened .+.+.+ To a large extent, education obviates the need for money.
Further, more educated nations can afford a lower birth rate.
William J. Sidis was nothing, if not educated.

At his 1919 trial, when he was 21,
he said something like: “ Evolution is my God. ”.

Q. What did that get him ?

A. A year of torture in his dad’s mental institution
plus a year of house arrest in California.
[ According to Bill Sidis,
he was ruthlessly tortured both day and night ]

I too say “ Evolution is my God. ”,
so I highly appreciate Sidis’ public assertion.
Society needs more people like him, I maintain.

Q. Why did Stalin ( and, to a lesser extent, Bush and Clinton )
Lord ( like “ Gods ” ) over
proverbial and/or litteral “ death camp forced labor ” ?

A. To promote their genes.

Is it any wonder than, that Sidis was a “ Consciencious Objector ” ?

As I see it,
forwarding one’s genes does not constitute a genuine purpose,
it’s merely –> something that happened
.+.+.+

]]>