Comments on: The Ruins of Fordlândia http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia A collection of Damn Interesting things Fri, 12 Mar 2010 02:57:58 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: galonga http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-25347 galonga Sun, 20 Sep 2009 02:54:04 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-25347 What I find most amazing on this story along with some of the comments afterwards is to see that so little has changed for some american mindsets ("Chanticrow" is a prime example), even though almost 100 years have passed. Ford FAILED. Period. His "american way of life" down-the-throat method and the clear fact that he thought that only because he was american he was doomed to success was the reason. And guess what would happen if you got these backward people and send them there too? They would ALSO fail. But they would bow their head and accept it was because of their own backwardness? Nope! :) What I find most amazing on this story along with some of the comments afterwards is to see that so little has changed for some american mindsets (“Chanticrow” is a prime example), even though almost 100 years have passed.

Ford FAILED. Period. His “american way of life” down-the-throat method and the clear fact that he thought that only because he was american he was doomed to success was the reason.

And guess what would happen if you got these backward people and send them there too? They would ALSO fail. But they would bow their head and accept it was because of their own backwardness? Nope! :)

]]> By: goopy http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-24368 goopy Fri, 24 Apr 2009 14:54:55 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-24368 I enjoyed this article. It is indeed an amazing story. I actually wrote a novel set in Fordlandia. It is still in the pre-release stages - I haven't opened it to internet searches. It took me six years to write and involved trips to the Amazon. It follows the story of a Ford executive and a rubber tapper. I would appreciate it if you checked it out: www.returnofthedeji.com (under 'Purchase Books'). I am happy to send you a free digital copy as well if you e-mail me. Thanks, Deji I enjoyed this article. It is indeed an amazing story.

I actually wrote a novel set in Fordlandia. It is still in the pre-release stages – I haven’t opened it to internet searches. It took me six years to write and involved trips to the Amazon. It follows the story of a Ford executive and a rubber tapper. I would appreciate it if you checked it out: http://www.returnofthedeji.com (under ‘Purchase Books’). I am happy to send you a free digital copy as well if you e-mail me.

Thanks,
Deji

]]> By: lordasm http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-23254 lordasm Thu, 06 Nov 2008 13:21:16 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-23254 Well, as being a Brazilian (even quite far away from Fordlândia (or Fordland, translating the name), what killed the Rubber Cycle in North Brazil was not the invention of synthetic rubber, was the fact that British stole rubber tree saplings from there and used it to make plantations in Asia. Of course American lifestyle would be met with hostility. In South Brazil (where I live) and in Southeast, people would be much more receptive to the American lifestyle, but even for Southern brazilians, North is a very different place and has a very different culture (I know because I'm married with a Northern brazilian girl, and even in my marriage, cultural differences were clear). First of all, the working shift... In the rain forest, Sun is too strong and climate is very humid, what makes the place VERY warm. It is quite hard to work in such conditions, and that's why people that do rural work works very early, stop around 10 o'clock, and resume work in the afternoon. Another problem is the food thing. As it is a very hot place, and the population have a lot of indigenous influence in their culture, they eat a lot light foods, like fruits (acai, bacuri, cupuacu) and stuff made with cassava roots (like flour, a liquid extracted from it called tucupi) and sea food (shrimps and fish mainly)... Hamburgers, bacon, sausages, this kind of stuff, make you very uncomfortable to work in such a hot place, worink in middday sun after eating that kind of stuff could only end in stomach aches, vomiting, and employees not being able to work. Another thing that I think would be a MAJOR problem is Ford's ban on alcohol. Northern brazilians do not smoke so often (I never saw someone smoking there, opposed to South Brazil, where ppl smoke a lot), but it is a national habit (at least in North and Northeast) to drink pinga, specially at lunch and after sunset, and this would really be a problem. I do not know about other things, such as regional dances (like Cumbia and Carimbó), but I imagine if American way was enforced, this would piss off the workers as well (being unable to manifest their own culture) Resuming, there's no way a North brazilian rural worker would like the american way of life, it is radically different, and it is a very bad idea to try to enforce a new culture in a place that love and give a lot of credit for their own culture. Brazil in 1920 was a quite recently formed republic (it was made in 1889), finally freed from the monarchy, and Brazil was quite suspicious of foreign capital, due to its previous experiences with Portugal and Great Britain, so it was natural that the brazilian government didnt help Henry Ford. North Brazil still is a large demographic desert, so imagine in 1920.... Brazil had little interest in developing there. Henry Ford's failure here in Brazil was due to his lack of planning, his arrogance in thinking he needed no botanist, that his managers would know how to work in a VERY different climate, with VERY different conditions, with a VERY different culture, for being a fool not asking a geologist to query the land before buying it, his lack of comprehension that Brazilians do not want to be like Americans, they have their own way and it works very well here (not better or worse than the american way, just different) and very bad timing (in 1920 the rubber cycle was ending and Belem and Manaus belle epoque was failing). Well, as being a Brazilian (even quite far away from Fordlândia (or Fordland, translating the name), what killed the Rubber Cycle in North Brazil was not the invention of synthetic rubber, was the fact that British stole rubber tree saplings from there and used it to make plantations in Asia.
Of course American lifestyle would be met with hostility. In South Brazil (where I live) and in Southeast, people would be much more receptive to the American lifestyle, but even for Southern brazilians, North is a very different place and has a very different culture (I know because I’m married with a Northern brazilian girl, and even in my marriage, cultural differences were clear).
First of all, the working shift… In the rain forest, Sun is too strong and climate is very humid, what makes the place VERY warm. It is quite hard to work in such conditions, and that’s why people that do rural work works very early, stop around 10 o’clock, and resume work in the afternoon.
Another problem is the food thing. As it is a very hot place, and the population have a lot of indigenous influence in their culture, they eat a lot light foods, like fruits (acai, bacuri, cupuacu) and stuff made with cassava roots (like flour, a liquid extracted from it called tucupi) and sea food (shrimps and fish mainly)… Hamburgers, bacon, sausages, this kind of stuff, make you very uncomfortable to work in such a hot place, worink in middday sun after eating that kind of stuff could only end in stomach aches, vomiting, and employees not being able to work.
Another thing that I think would be a MAJOR problem is Ford’s ban on alcohol. Northern brazilians do not smoke so often (I never saw someone smoking there, opposed to South Brazil, where ppl smoke a lot), but it is a national habit (at least in North and Northeast) to drink pinga, specially at lunch and after sunset, and this would really be a problem.
I do not know about other things, such as regional dances (like Cumbia and Carimbó), but I imagine if American way was enforced, this would piss off the workers as well (being unable to manifest their own culture)

Resuming, there’s no way a North brazilian rural worker would like the american way of life, it is radically different, and it is a very bad idea to try to enforce a new culture in a place that love and give a lot of credit for their own culture.

Brazil in 1920 was a quite recently formed republic (it was made in 1889), finally freed from the monarchy, and Brazil was quite suspicious of foreign capital, due to its previous experiences with Portugal and Great Britain, so it was natural that the brazilian government didnt help Henry Ford. North Brazil still is a large demographic desert, so imagine in 1920…. Brazil had little interest in developing there.

Henry Ford’s failure here in Brazil was due to his lack of planning, his arrogance in thinking he needed no botanist, that his managers would know how to work in a VERY different climate, with VERY different conditions, with a VERY different culture, for being a fool not asking a geologist to query the land before buying it, his lack of comprehension that Brazilians do not want to be like Americans, they have their own way and it works very well here (not better or worse than the american way, just different) and very bad timing (in 1920 the rubber cycle was ending and Belem and Manaus belle epoque was failing).

]]> By: Intelligoth http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-23191 Intelligoth Fri, 24 Oct 2008 17:17:04 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-23191 "his efforts to spread his American "healthy lifestyle" were met with resentment and hostility" It seems that any time Americans try to export their value systems, they are met with significant resistance. Just an observation. “his efforts to spread his American “healthy lifestyle” were met with resentment and hostility”

It seems that any time Americans try to export their value systems, they are met with significant resistance. Just an observation.

]]> By: katieq95 http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-23077 katieq95 Tue, 14 Oct 2008 21:53:57 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-23077 [quote]MJ Smith said: "Wow. Amazing the stuff that South America lets happen sometimes. 'Sure, come here! Have this land, use it, try and change our people!' Wouldn't fly well in this day and age."[/quote] that is really dumb and rude to say. Henry ford had a reputation as a wealthy and intelligent man. He *BOUGHT* that land to try something and south america trusted him. there is no reason not to trust him he hadn't known that rubber trees could be manipulated the way he thought. I'm sure you didn't either you donkey! [quote]MJ Smith said: “Wow. Amazing the stuff that South America lets happen sometimes.

‘Sure, come here! Have this land, use it, try and change our people!’

Wouldn’t fly well in this day and age.”[/quote]

that is really dumb and rude to say. Henry ford had a reputation as a wealthy and intelligent man. He *BOUGHT* that land to try something and south america trusted him. there is no reason not to trust him he hadn’t known that rubber trees could be manipulated the way he thought. I’m sure you didn’t either you donkey!

]]> By: a1c http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-22441 a1c Sat, 09 Aug 2008 05:08:12 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-22441 They'd been better off making charcoal briquets. They’d been better off making charcoal briquets.

]]> By: Ken E http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-13871 Ken E Sat, 07 Apr 2007 10:51:57 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-13871 <p>This story reminds me of an attempt at mass farming on marginal country in Australia, undertaken by the British at the end of the 1940s. The Queensland British Food Corporation (QBFC) was supposed to grow grain sorghum near Emerald in Central Queensland for stock food. The resulting pork, beef etc was to be consumed in rationed Britain. In the case of the QBFC, things were perhaps better planned and though a failure, did manage to produce something. The problems included mouse plagues, drought and agronomists who insisted that planting take place according to a regular schedule, whether or not worthwhile rain had fallen. The scheme was wound up in the mid 1950s and a lot of local farmers bought good used machinery for a song. A large irrigation dam was built in the late 1960s and much of the old sorghum land is now under cotton. </p> This story reminds me of an attempt at mass farming on marginal country in Australia, undertaken by the British at the end of the 1940s. The Queensland British Food Corporation (QBFC) was supposed to grow grain sorghum near Emerald in Central Queensland for stock food. The resulting pork, beef etc was to be consumed in rationed Britain. In the case of the QBFC, things were perhaps better planned and though a failure, did manage to produce something. The problems included mouse plagues, drought and agronomists who insisted that planting take place according to a regular schedule, whether or not worthwhile rain had fallen. The scheme was wound up in the mid 1950s and a lot of local farmers bought good used machinery for a song. A large irrigation dam was built in the late 1960s and much of the old sorghum land is now under cotton.

]]> By: JoJo http://www.damninteresting.com/the-ruins-of-fordlandia#comment-11310 JoJo Tue, 26 Dec 2006 23:28:59 +0000 http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=596#comment-11310 <p>I wouldn't mind trying to live on what he had left after all his losses.</p> I wouldn’t mind trying to live on what he had left after all his losses.

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